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View Poll Results: What flavour of Vanilla do you want?
Completely Vanilla 3 8.33%
Vanilla + Ubersaw, Kritzkrieg & Blutsaugar 4 11.11%
Vanilla + Ubersaw, Kritzkrieg, Blutsaugar & Equaliser 20 55.56%
OZFL unlocks list 9 25.00%
Voters: 36. This poll is closed

 
 
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Old 6th April 2011, 05:04 PM   #41
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With the way the game is currently played gunboats are very effective because the strategies that incorporate them are very effective. The secondary dying early, often taking down a demo and/or forcing the other team into a bad position, will then respawn and get back into the fight before the players he just got killed, thanks to the speed he can have without heals.

Also with the current popular strategies, secondaries do not get enough heals to really make use of a shotgun anyway - if they are in a situation where it is useful they are pretty much dead (apart from the obvious defending/pushing last, denying spire-jumpers).

It IS very useful to have shotgun when the pocket goes down/moves out of position for whatever reason, though.

Would be nice if valve allowed the quick-loadout-menu to work for changing off gunboats.

But it will be fun to have them out of the game for a change of pace, will force teams to play differently.

Last edited by blank; 6th April 2011 at 05:08 PM.
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Old 6th April 2011, 05:35 PM   #42
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I'm just curious, how many of the people that voted are actually going to be playing ?

Cuz I'd be a little pissed if it was a bunch of vanilla elitists just being haters and not even playing.
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Old 6th April 2011, 07:35 PM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blank View Post
Would be nice if valve allowed the quick-loadout-menu to work for changing off gunboats.
it does?
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Old 6th April 2011, 08:00 PM   #44
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Originally Posted by combustible View Post
it does?
I don't believe so. You can't fast switch between spy watches because you can't actually switch between whatever weapon you're using at the time and the watch, just like the gunboats and razorback. Im sure someone could word what i'm trying to say a bit better and i apologise for being an idiot and if what i said doesn't make sense.
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Old 6th April 2011, 08:24 PM   #45
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you're being a idiot pj and it doesnt make sense
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Old 6th April 2011, 08:29 PM   #46
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so last week

just press 2 when u open the quickswitch menu
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Old 6th April 2011, 10:17 PM
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Old 7th April 2011, 02:07 AM   #47
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hmm, maybe hud/config related? i hold down alt (used to use q) and press 2, then scroll wheel down to shotgun and select it (quite awkward, i know).

I can see it not working for spy watch seeing as you cant normally swap to its weapon slot, whereas with gunboats (slot2) you can (or should be able to) select that slot by pressing 2 (by default).

not that i use shotgun in anything apart from mge lolz
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Old 7th April 2011, 12:02 PM   #48
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From what I can find via google, you and decap appear to be the only two people it works for
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Old 7th April 2011, 12:18 PM   #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blank View Post
With the way the game is currently played gunboats are very effective because the strategies that incorporate them are very effective. The secondary dying early, often taking down a demo and/or forcing the other team into a bad position, will then respawn and get back into the fight before the players he just got killed, thanks to the speed he can have without heals.

Also with the current popular strategies, secondaries do not get enough heals to really make use of a shotgun anyway - if they are in a situation where it is useful they are pretty much dead (apart from the obvious defending/pushing last, denying spire-jumpers).

It IS very useful to have shotgun when the pocket goes down/moves out of position for whatever reason, though.

Would be nice if valve allowed the quick-loadout-menu to work for changing off gunboats.

But it will be fun to have them out of the game for a change of pace, will force teams to play differently.
^ This - I can rollout faster than the opposition scouts on Badlands and be waiting on the opposition crates before the soldiers jump on granary with the gunboats, on nearly full health, and I may lack a shotgun but it gives me the option of firing a few rockets close up at important targets and retreating or attempting a pick if I see the opportunity. And if I do fuck up and die I can be back with my team far faster than I would be otherwise.

Those two scenarios and aimlessly jumping the opposition med aren't the main advantage to the gunboats though, their main advantage is that they allow you to distract the opposition and pull them out of position with ease, and if this is timed correctly with proper communication between you and your team you can make advantages and in most cases still escape with your life.

I still have a lot of work to do on my strats for making these plays effective but it doesn't deter from their potential and I think anything play that forces a team to change strats on the fly is good for the game and good for the opposition, instead of the same old bottlenecks the likes of gunboats allow the game to keep moving and forces everyone to adapt their play style.

That said I can certainly see where the likes of Rocky is coming from, but even rocket jumping when you have to and not taking fall damage still means you can't take as many chances when making plays as roamer because you just don't have the easy access to heals. There is nothing worse than trying to stop an opposiiton play as roamer equiped with the shotgun, only to find the scout you were heading off has just taken the large health pack.

Again it just allows the roamer to use a different skill set. My rocket aim improved considerably using the gunboats because in the past I knew if I missed a rocket I could finish them off with the shotgun, whereas with the boots every rocket counts that much more.
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Old 7th April 2011, 12:57 PM   #50
decap decap is offline
so last week

Quote:
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From what I can find via google, you and decap appear to be the only two people it works for
afaik it doesn't work if you have scripts on your weapon keys (like changing crosshair/viewmodels), you have to have the default bind.
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Old 7th April 2011, 01:05 PM   #51
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Too right.

Have made a new slot 2 bind for it. Thanks!
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Old 7th April 2011, 01:07 PM   #52
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I hadn't come across that menu, is it a standard feature nowadays or is it more hud only?

I use pvhud if that makes any difference
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Old 7th April 2011, 04:15 PM   #53
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Shouldn't do. Its a feature that's been around for ages and has been neglected since.
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The boats are underrated to an extent and at the same time they are overrated, why? They're way to situational.

On maps with large, open areas for jumping such as the initial rush on granary or yukon, boats are ideal for getting there quickly and setting up a offensive/defensive position, however its just hurting your team; your medic can only heal one soldier who cannot equalize while the other is reaching middle with less than 200 while your team is being split up for easier picks.

On slower soldier maps like the badlands rush, roamers have less leeway on how they reach middle quickly; either a fast spire push or a valley jump, and generally his only purpose serves is for distracting the demo at mid or trying to hold the heavies in house. Most time the roamer will jump in/flank while his team is focusing and die and/or get a pick. A fast demoman shouldn't have much trouble at all containing the roamer as he enters.

Its just such a hit or miss tactic, lol. If you fuck up your teams down a soldier and if you get a pick you will probably die while taking out a key target. Its like playing Spy and trying to get a stab on that medic or a quick cap on the last point. Its a yes or no answer.

Last edited by rocky; 7th April 2011 at 04:20 PM.
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Old 7th April 2011, 06:22 PM   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by decap View Post
afaik it doesn't work if you have scripts on your weapon keys (like changing crosshair/viewmodels), you have to have the default bind.
mine works fine (with 2 bound to "weapon2"), and i use brosel's (sp?) rather complicated crosshair switching script, maybe he put something in there to make it work idk

edit: yeah broesel is a genius

http://code.google.com/p/broeselhud/
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Last edited by combust; 7th April 2011 at 06:34 PM.
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Old 7th April 2011, 06:25 PM   #55
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With good coordination, the few seconds of distraction a secondary playing that way can provide is enough for his teammates to destroy the other team. If his movements are not well coordinated with his team, he is completely useless.

A secondary getting actual picks like that really shouldn't work, but it does because the team he is jumping at is bad/chokes.

If you watch US/Euro the secondaries do pretty much nothing in terms of damage, but they create the openings for their team to do something.
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Old 8th April 2011, 05:42 PM   #56
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Listen to blank hes been playing team fortress for an embarrassingly long amount of time ( greg)
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